Art Space Talk: Ray Cabarga

Ray Cabarga has been surrounded by visual art and music for most of his life. Ray's delight in experimentation is what attracted me to his work, specifically a series of paintings that he calls 'oozings'. This body of work reveals total disregard for traditional methods of painting application. However, they also convey a strong bond with the art theories of Wassily Kandinsky-- which I find appealing. Ray's work reveals the fruit that can be produced from planting unknown seeds-- a field of mystery.

Brian Sherwin: Ray, you were born into a family of visual artist, but chose music. You performed jazz and salsa throughout the bay area for fifteen years before placing total focus on your visual art. That focus has been solid for over ten years now. How has your experience as a musician influenced your visual art?

Ray Cabarga: Greatly, actually. I see music as being directly analogous to visual art and of course all art is a metaphor for life. All the same principles in music apply to visual art, just the specifics are different. The tones are color values, the familiar phrases are figurative representations, the tension created by obscure variations or from the structure of the musical form are the abstractions or impressionistic forms in the painting. They say that playing music develops your brain in a unique way that opens and expands creative thinking and I think writing, arranging, performing and improvising music has all given me a leg up on visual art almost as if I had been practicing it all along. However, the technique is completely unrelated so that was a transition, but technique has always followed concept for me: If I see it clearly in my head, I can paint it.

BS: Ray, how exactly did your family influence you as far as visual art is concerned?

RC: Well, my dad is an accomplished painter and was a commercial artist for 45 years, art directing in New York, then owning an ad agency in San Francisco. My eldest brother is a commercial artist and has had over 25 books published. My youngest brother is a painter and a commercial artist. My sister is a clothing designer and is in some very high end boutiques. And the brother just below me in age plays clarinet with the National Symphony Orchestra in D.C. so its all around me and we have all had a lot of encouragement from both parents to pursue art careers. Oh, I forgot to mention my mother who is a martial arts master, mostly healing arts, and a teacher, though both parents are retired they continue to pursue their art forms.

BS: Where else do you draw inspiration from? Can you discuss your influences outside of music?

RC: The masters of course. Dali, Escher, Kandinsky, Gorky are some of my favorites. all the impressionists and surrealists and many of my contemporaries as well. I spend a lot of time looking at art on websites such as this one and regularly peruse galleries and other art venues. Early childhood memories of visits to the Guggenheim and the Smithsonian-- even the paintings my dad had done and hung in our house back east, to this day, strongly influence me. It's like I can still see those images with a child's mind and feel the awe and wonder that I felt at three.

BS: Ray, you have a unique way of painting... you call these painting 'oozings'. I've read that specific conditions must be met in order for these paintings to be created. It is my understanding that these paintings do not involve any brushwork. Would you say that you control the outcome or do you let nature take it's course, so to speak?

RC: With this particular painting technique, which by the way is only one type of painting I do, I throw away or recycle about 9 out of every ten canvases I attempt so 1 out of ten turn out well. So you might say I let nature take its course but certain very specific conditions affect that and it's become almost a form of alchemy or magic to achieve those perfect conditions. The really good ones are never planned-- planning seems to preclude success and I have to almost step away and detach myself from the work in order for it to do it's thing. It's a discipline in letting go of control of my art which is a very big life lesson for me. To trust the art to paint itself without my constant cajoling and persuading, without my preconceptions of how it should proceed and where it should start and end. It's largely about timing and quantities and being able to put the elements in the environment and then leave it alone for the exact duration and no longer.

BS: Ray, can you go into further detail about the process of creating your 'Oozings'?

RC: Sure I start by mixing ordinary acrylic paints with flow mediums and glazing mediums, acrylic enamels work the best and then I mix colors with glass and porcelain glazes and start applying them to either canvas or gessoed Masonite board. The larger the board the harder it is to make it work. The glazes are basically poured onto the surface and allowed to partially dry for anywhere from 3 minutes to fifteen minutes but this duration is critical. Then I run hot or cold water over it and rinse a lot of it off. Now I start applying the acrylic mixtures and alternate running water over it or drying it with a hairdryer all the while changing the angle so that more or less paint, water and glaze run off. At this point I may add more elements of color but basically after a certain cut-off point I can't add anything else and I leave it to ooze at a certain angle and temperature-- either room temperature or under a heat lamp to slow the oozing and freeze it which is almost impossible to do. After my work is done is when the truly amazing art is created ironically. Kind of like children. You create them and then you just sit back and watch them blow your mind. They show you what you wish you could do. Don't try to control what they do because you'll fail at that endeavor and more importantly you'll deprive yourself of seeing the result of your own evolution. Oozings are exactly like children Brian, all you can do is give them the best you've got and then trust them to do the right thing. And then you accept whatever they turns out to be, because you can't change it. That's what Oozings, and progeny are all about.

BS: So... you are an artist who likes to take chances. Do you think that is something that is missing in a lot of the art that is created today?

RC: Oh yes. Art that doesn't take chances is hardly art at all now is it? What's the point of that. If you want a realistic representation of something, a camera would be my first choice. It is more than taking chances though... it is like creating chances. For everything I can perceive, there's a million things I can imagine. So I would never waste my time on something that's been done, even if it was done by the greatest artist in the universe... the universe... I have my own little universe going here and the only limit I have is how much I can perceive and then from those perceptions, how much I can imagine in my lifetime.

BS: Do you plan to discover other unique ways to build the surface of your work? As an artist, are you concerned with finding new methods and techniques of artistic creation?

RC: Not concerned but definitely open to the possibility. I forgot to mention I discovered Oozings completely by accident. I was trying to do a portrait and it didn't turn out so I tried to wash the board off before it dried. The phone rang and I left the room then forgot about it. When I came back three hours later My first oozing was sitting there and it was the most amazing thing I've ever seen. I tried to recreate the process but I never have exactly done that the best. I know what your next question is going to be, "Can I see the original painting?" and the answer is no-- no one ever can I had to destroy it because it was too amazing for anyone to gaze upon. I'm Kidding!

BS: Ray, what is your studio space like? What are the conditions you need in order to create? Do you follow a steady routine of studio practice?

RC: Nope! No pre-requisite conditions. Usually the art is all created in my head before I start working and I just need enough room to move my elbow and someplace to put it to dry when it is done-- seriously. I'm sure there are ideal conditions for the piece of art I'm working on but I never know what those are so I just do it anywhere.

BS: Ray, do you have any upcoming exhibitions? Also, are you represented by a gallery? If not, are you seeking representation?

RC: Funny you should ask that. Have you ever heard of an artist that spends all his time creating art and doesn't give nearly enough attention to self-promotion? And does a large carnivorous quadruped relieve himself among the natural arboreal growth? I'm currently seeking representation, yes.

BS: What projects are you working on at this time?

RC: A piece commissioned by a client who loves physical representations of old sayings. Its a four foot diameter globe of the earth constructed out of oyster shells. Can you figure out what old adage this represents?

BS: Finally, is there anything else you would like to say about your art or the artworld?

RC: I love art and artists and the artworld. Art is my life so people should buy my art before my death because the price goes up after that!

You can view my other interviews with emerging and established artists by visiting the following link: www.myartspace.com/interviews

Take care, Stay true,

Brian Sherwin

Art Space Talk: Heather Hutchison

Heather Hutchison is a very humble artist considering the fact that she has gained great success in New York City. Her work has been featured in ARTnews, Art in America, and several other publications. By applying tinted beeswax in horizontal bands to Plexiglass panels, Hutchison creates see-through paintings that are subtle, yet contain the powerful essence of nature. These panels are attached to wooden frames that create a form of controlled atmosphere. In my opinion, these works reflect the conflict that results from aspects of the natural world when they are contained-- there is certain tension about this work. In the end-- through the force of light-- nature dominates.

Brian Sherwin: Heather, can you tell us about your youth? When did you decide to pursue art? Can you recall any early experiences or events that directed you on this path? Also, who were your early mentors?

Heather Hutchison: My father was a caricaturist. Early on my parents, my two brothers and I would travel every six months from Arizona to Oregon and back again visiting with his artist friends while he did "the circuit." My parents then decided to settle down, and from ages six through thirteen I lived with my family in a grand old hotel we owned called, "The Copper Queen," in Bisbee, Arizona six miles North of the Mexican border.It was the early 1970's and people were seeking refuge in this small burgeoning artist colony from "yuppies". They were pouring in from places that they felt were already being ruined like Aspen, San Francisco, Marin County, and New York, lots of guys coming out of Viet Nam as well... as a young kid I was aware that it was a a time of massive change.

I feel fortunate for the amount of freedom living in the hotel afforded me, it was in the center of the town, which is built like a European village, nestled a mile high in the mountains-- everything within walking distance. I developed inspiring friendships with many interesting adults, visionaries, writers, artists,and hippies. I would spend time with them in their studios and homes independent of my family. Having been influenced by all of these artist's lifestyles and witnessing their work practices, I began a studio practice before I was ten years old. The hotel and our other properties gave me an enormous amount of space, enabling me to set up a studio.

I was lucky to grow up knowing that I had come from at least four generations of professional artists and to have it reinforced throughout my whole life that being an artist is a valid lifestyle choice. I was so convinced that I didn't see the need for art school. This wasn't because I thought I knew everything-- I still know nothing-- but, because I had learned through experience that being an artist meant having original vision, and at eighteen I couldn't imagine how being confined to an institution with hundreds of other inexperienced youths who were being taught by the same handful of teachers could help that much in attaining originality. If I'd been thinking about a career back then I would have tried to get into Yale.
BS: Heather, you have been reviewed by ARTnews, Art in America, The New York Times, and several other publications. How do you feel when your work is selected for coverage? Do you get excited? Nervous?

HH: I usually feel hopeful that a critic is going to write something that will help me to see my work from a different perspective, that it will teach me something about what I am doing, and then I am often disappointed that it doesn't enlighten me at all. I suppose that is something I could have gotten over by getting crits in art school.

BS: Heather, your Minimalist work often reminds viewers of the natural elements of nature- light, ice, water and earth. Are you influenced by nature?

HH: Yes, to borrow from Pollock, "I am nature" and I am coming back into being more nature as I grow closer to returning to dust. This is the world I, and every other art making, art viewing human exist in... I think it is impossible to escape the influence of nature even if the work isn't recognizably "nature based," it is-- it can't help it. But, yes I do embrace that metaphor. I am working to make it be not such an easy one to come to... sometimes I can't resist.
BS: For those not familiar with your art, what do you strive to convey in your work?

HH: It seems that whenever I consciously "try" to convey anything it is a disaster, self-conscious, and corny...so I avoid doing that. Sometimes people don't notice my paintings at all, sometimes they are extremely moved. I think it all depends on what the viewer brings to the viewing experience, no matter what your looking at.

Heather Hutchison- Black & Light (2007)120 x 240 inches, site specific, fabric & paint

BS: Heather, for over twenty years, you have developed a visual language that utilizes components of painting- light, color and depth. You combine these methods convey a sense of emotion, memory and the passage of time- with a focus on translucent media. Where do you see your work going next? Also, What are you working on at this time?

HH: In July I finally created an installation I have ruminated on for the last 13 years. I had organized an exhibition in Woodstock, New York (I have been curating lately), the curatorial focus being artists in different medium that limit their palette to black and light. When it came to planning the hanging I realized that the show needed something to regulate the light that was coming in to the space... this was a push and an opportunity to realize this long desired installation.

I utilized a large window covering it with layers of different translucent materials... and painting the wall to recede, the end result being a completely flat field of light that was constantly changing with the movement of the daylight, sun going behind clouds, buildings, etc. I collaborated with videographer Dean Janoff and we made a 24hour time-lapsed video condensed into 3 minutes that I am very pleased with. Both the video and the installation are fixed yet constantly changing-- that is something I would like my other pieces to do... the paintings/ sculptures I am making since July have learned from that experience. I am working on having the opportunity to realize more of these window pieces in public spaces-- I can do them most anywhere.
BS: I assume that creating art is a constant form of exploration for you... correct?
HH: Correct.

BS: Heather, Elanor Heartney (ARTnews) stated that your work demonstrates some similarities with the work of Eva Hesse and Christopher Wilmarth in that your manner of Minimalism often enhances the use of metaphor instead of taking away from it. Do you agree with that statement?

HH: Definitely, that was one of the writings that I actually learned something from.

BS: Heather, your work sometimes deals with religious or metaphysical concerns. Would you say that you are a spiritual person? If so, how does that spirituality enter your artistic practice?

HH: You could say that I am spiritual. I don't have a rigid ritualistic practice-- I've tried, but once again I start questioning the conformity. I have always just been looking for answers. My study and experience of religion is usually focused on the the philosophy of the religion. My artistic practice, my studio, and now raising a human being (my son) are what is most sacred to me. It is in the studio and through the meditative practice of making work that I feel I have come closest to any truths.
BS: Heather, can you tell us about your other influences? What artists or art movements have influenced your art?

HH: Another by-product of being self-taught... when I started working with translucency and light in 1988 I wasn't aware of the California Light and Space Movement-- in 1990 a dealer from L.A. turned me on to it.I am inspired by, and feel I am working parallel to, much of that work. Later, after making work that is a direct result of process and application for about ten years I discovered that there was a Process Art movement. It is reassuring to me to have other artists share my obsessions-- I feel less crazy.

The minimalism that was being created at about the time I was born (early sixties) has resonated the longest and most consistently with me. Major influences and inspiration from other artists in chronological order since my early twenties: Album art, Magritte, Hopper, Guy Pene du Bois, Barnett Newman, Agnes Martin, Donald Judd, Joseph Amar, Christopher Wilmarth, Menardo Rosso, Turner, Camille Corot, Corbet, Giovanni Bellini, Giorgio Morandi, Robert Irwin.

BS: Heather, where else do you draw inspiration from?

HH: I believe I am obsessed with particular horizontal divisions of space that for some reason resonate with me, I can also be transfixed by the movement of water and light. Raw materials really turn me on as well.

BS: Tell us about your work space... what is your studio like?

HH: I have two great studios, One in DUMBO Brooklyn that has big windows that look at the city, the Manhattan Bridge, and the River. The other is in Woodstock, NY where we have had a home for 12 years. For the last five years it has been our primary residence, we are in the woods on a private dirt road that no one drives up... we turned a large post and beam pole-barn into studios, my husband paints upstairs and I have the bottom floor. It is only 30 feet from the house.

We have an eight year old son and at this time in my life keeping the balance between the home and the studio feels right to me. I will be working and while something is drying I run in to the house and start some soup.While that is cooking I will go back in to the studio and continue working on a piece. We originally came to the country because I was feeling that our life in New York City was out of balance, with too much emphasis on the self-referential art world and having a "career," not enough awareness about the life we were living.

I am happy to be up here having a family and an extremely high quality lifestyle... in the long run it is important for the work. I have realized that I am in it for the long run and having distance (2 hours) on the artworld allows me to be happy, refreshed, and non-competitive when I am in the heart of it.
BS: What are the conditions you need in order to create? For example, do you work in silence or do you listen to music? Do you work alone or do you prefer company?

HH: I work alone. I can go through a certain amount of the process with someone in the studio or working with me, but the point where the piece is actually coming to it's own has to be done in solitude-- usually with one CD (probably Bob Dylan) playing over and over to the point where I can't really even hear it anymore it just becomes part of me, like my heart beat.

BS: Heather, tell us more about your artistic process. How do you start a piece? When do you know that it is done?

HH: Without a pre-conceived idea of what the work will be I start by deciding the dimensions of the plywood box, and whether or not to build multiple panels. I build my own forms from Birch plywood that I rip into boards on the table-saw. I choose the boards for their grain and warp. Then I mount and route the Plexiglas. After the form is done I start applying color to the inside of the box and the surface of the Plexi. It is in finding the right balance of the inside and surface color that will give me the overall color(s).

Once the color is determined I scrape it back down and begin playing with composition I apply the color to the composition until it is a painting/sculpture, meaning that it can stand on it's own as a painting/sculpture and it transcends looking like a piece of furniture or a light fixture. This can sometimes take months to determine... I let things hang out to see if they pass the test of time. Sometimes things will come back to the studio years later and I will rework them-- they didn't pass. I think everyone does that.BS: Heather, where can our readers view your art in person? Also, are you involved with any upcoming exhibitions?

HH: I am represented in Manhattan by Margaret Thatcher at 511 W. 25th st., she usually has something up in the back-- she will be taking my work to the 07 art fair in London and Pulse in Miami. I'll be having a solo show at the gallery in a year or so, date yet to be determined. We are pretty good about keeping upcoming shows posted on my website www.heatherhutchison.com.

BS: Heather, do you have any advice for artists who are just starting out? Perhaps you have some suggestions for seeking gallery representation or issues that emerging artists should be aware of in the artworld?

HH: I have noticed that success has to do with luck, working as hard as you can, and bugging people until you get what you want. If possible, arrange for, or marry someone with, a sizable trust fund. I am lucky, but not lucky enough to have a trust fund... I have been working for years on being able to bug people-- but I am just too sensitive. I have been training my son since he was born to be lucky by constantly pointing out his good fortune, it is all in your self-perception.

BS: Finally, is there anything else you would like to say about your art or the artworld?

HH: Yes Brian, since you asked, I think it is imperative to the future of contemporary art that the artworld (artmarket) remember that it was started by and would not exist without artists.

You can learn more about Heather Hutchison by visiting her website: www.heatherhutchison.com. You can view my other interviews by clicking on the following link: www.myartspace.com/interviews

Take care, Stay true,

Brian Sherwin

Art Space News: SH Contemporary Art Fair in Shanghai

Nondescript (diptych) Year 2005 - Medium oil on canvas Size 55.1 x 110.2 in. By Qiu Xin

The opening night of the SH Contemporary Art Fair in Shanghai was a great success. Upon entering visitors were greeted by an artist who passed out a snack of rice with a hidden message among the grains-- "Rich Bastards Beware.'' Oddly enough, the 'fair-warning' by artist Rirkrit Tiravanija was warranted! For example, collectors paid as much as 150,000 yuan ($19,885) for the work of emerging artist Qiu Xin.

Collectors and critics know that China is a rising star in the global art market. The Shanghai Fair served as a test of that stability and of the vitality of China within the context of the global art market. On the opening night, leading Chinese artists made the highest sells when compared to artists from other nations. Those who attended agree that China's influence on the art market will not stop anytime soon.

Fair director Lorenzo Rudolph, a former director of Art Basel, and Swiss dealer Pierre Huber, the curator, organized more than 110 galleries from around the world. About a third of the galleries represented at the fair are from China and the rest were foreign galleries that focus on Chinese art. Event organizers made it clear that the fair would represent the best and brightest of artists from China.

An interesting aspect of the fair is the fact that the galleries from China, which represented artists working from within the country, out-sold the Chinese artists represented by foreign galleries. Again, this is a reflection of the art-boom in China. Collectors desire work from Chinese artists who live and work in China. I find it interesting how Chinese artists living outside of China were not as sought after by collectors.

Not everyone was pleased with the fair. Some viewers felt that the majority of the work, though fulfilling the purpose of spot-lighting contemporary Asian artists, catered toward the current trends that Western viewers enjoy-- trends that embrace kitsch mingled with sex. What can I say, sex sales! If the market for contemporary art from China continues to grow-- you had better be buying!

Take care, Stay true,

Brian Sherwin

Art Space Talk: Pat Lipsky

Pat Lipsky has dedicated herself to painting for several decades. Lipsky graduated from Cornell University with a BFA in 1963, following which she attended the graduate program in painting at Hunter College where she studied with the sculptor, Tony Smith.

Lipsky's paintings have been reviewed by David Cohen (The New York Sun), Ken Johnson (The New York Times), Alicia Turner (The Miami Herald), Karen Wilkin (Art in America), Alexi Worth (The New Yorker) -- among others. Her paintings are in twenty-four public collections: The Whitney, The Hirshhorn, The San Francisco Museum of Modern Art, and she has had twenty-eight solo exhibits.

Installation, Color Paintings, 2006, Elizabeth Harris

Brian Sherwin: Pat, through the years you have had several solo and group exhibitions -- including group exhibitions -- Whitney Museum of American Art (New York). How do exhibitions make you feel? Do you learn from them -- as in, do you take in all the information you can about your work from onlookers?

Pat Lipsky: Exhibitions make me feel nervous at first, and are also often a goal to work towards (although I work all the time, with or without an upcoming show). I have learned a great deal from my shows. They're one of my best teachers -- seeing the work up, out of the studio, and looking at it with "foreign eyes" is very illuminating. There were some shows early on where I felt (as the woman in Eliot’s "Prufrock") that "that is not what I meant at all. That is not it at all." The viewer is of course important too, but somehow the first thing is my own eye. It’s always fascinating to get another person’s take, especially someone you respect, and it's also interesting and instructive to see which paintings resonate with professional viewers, and critics.
Blue Border, oil on canvas, 70 1/2" x 68 3/4", 2002

BS: You have been reviewed in The New York Times, Art in America, The New York Sun, ARTnews, and several other publications. Thinking back on your early years, did you ever expect your work to gain this much attention?

PL: In all candor, I did. I’m like any artist: I feel there hasn’t been enough. Yes. That’s because I had a strange start in the art world. Almost a year after graduating from Hunter College’s
Master’s program my work was taken on by one of the then-best galleries in New York City, Andre Emmerich. This was perhaps an unrealistic debut and spoiled me for what a life in art might be. I immediately started selling the stained paintings -- two styles: burst and wave -- that I was doing at the time, and there was attention from the press and even a kind of odd bonus, a solo show at the Everson Museum in Syracuse. So I got the idea that this was the way it was going to be. And then, to my surprise, the lean years came. So to answer the question, my work gaining attention and being reviewed was something I expected from my early years -- although not, of course, as a student.

That’s That, oil on canvas, 53 1/4” x 67 1/2”, 2002

BS: Speaking of your early years, can you recall any periods or events of your youth that helped pave the way toward your exploration of art?

PL: Good question. I guess you could start with my mother taking me, when I was seven, to study painting with an elderly man in the neighborhood who had a framing shop. I sat in back, in a little booth, and he taught me how to use oil paint, how to make a tree, and a path, and put clouds in the sky. This appeared magical to me, but I’d already been drawing, and working with crayon and watercolor so it wasn’t so strange to find myself working in oil at that age. Then 17 years later there was Tony Smith, a great teacher whom I had the privilege of studying with in graduate school. He had a real sensitivity to color, and helped me to both refine and re-find color in my painting. And then, too, there was seeing my first Rothko at the Jewish Museum in a show created by a Cornell teacher Alan Solomon. I gasped when I saw that first painting, an orange and yellow. I didn’t know that you could do that in painting, make color so obviously the subject. (Even though Rothko claims in his writing that color is not the subject.)

BS: You studied at Hunter College, The Art Students League, and Cornell University. Who were your mentors during those years? Can you recall any interesting experiences from your apprentice years?

PL: The Jewish Museum show was a big moment. I would add this anecdote about the Art Students League, where I studied during a semester, I took off from Cornell. The teacher was the painter Charles Alston. I was in the class painting from the model; there I was with my canvas and palette starting to work when Alston came up to me and said, "Why are you doing that? Painting from the model?" I was stunned. Wasn’t that what you were supposed to do in a figurative class? He said, "Why don’t you try an abstract painting?" The question frightened me, but I was always one to take a dare. So even though it felt totally alien and I didn’t really know how to do it, that’s when I painted my first abstract canvas.

Alan Solomon at Cornell was also instrumental in that he knew the scene in New York; he served as Director of The Jewish Museum at the same time he taught in Ithaca, and he would tell me every weekend what I should see in New York. I’d ride the Greyhound bus to town and visit the galleries and museums he suggested. As well as the Rothko, I saw the first stained paintings by Louis, Frankenthaler and Noland. The new acrylic paint invented by Lenny Bocour allowed painters to work directly into the canvas, as Pollock had done with enamel, instead of on it. I also remember Jan Mueller and the early Stellas -- as well as Rauschenberg, whose work I detested.

Homage to Bellini, oil on linen, 81 3/4" x 62", 2006

BS: Pat, you have also been an art instructor. You taught at Parsons School of Design, Hunter College, San Francisco Art Institute, and several other schools. During those years how did you find balance between being an instructor and creating your own art? Also, can you describe your instruction philosophy: in your opinion, what is the best way for an art student to learn?

PL: I found it extremely difficult to balance teaching with painting. Very few painters will say this -- it’s the thing you aren’t supposed to say. You should say, "I grew and I changed" or "the students' fresh attitude helped me see my own work in a blah-blah way." I just saw it as a big intrusion, three days a week. I knew every exit sign in the building; this is a hard thing for students to know, but it’s something most painters and sculptors will admit, and a lot of writing teachers too. It’s better, of course, when there is a really interested student.

As for my instruction philosophy, I told the students to look at painting; I took them to see paintings whenever possible. And I told them not to listen to what Harold Bloom calls "the cheerleaders" in the art and art history departments, who were pushing outsider art, feminist art, video art, each for a semester, but to look at the masters who had created the tradition. As Donald Judd once wrote, "When you need a plumbing job done, you call a working plumber." Except in rare instances, it’s more a situation of surviving art school with your enthusiasm and talent intact. I like the Gertrude Stein quote: "Genius is knowing who to be influenced by."

Proust’s Sea, oil on linen, 81 3/4” x 62 3/8", 2006

BS: I see you once gave a lecture at the Pollock-Krasner House. Can you recall what you spoke about? Also, do you plan to give any lectures about art in the near future?

PL: The Pollock-Krasner House -- that was a lot of fun. The topic was "What Tony, Lee and Clem Told Me"; that is, what I’d learned from Tony Smith, Lee Krasner and Clement Greenberg. (I knew the latter best.) I particularly compared Greenberg and Smith; what was so interesting was that they were talking about the same people --Pollock, Barnett Newman, Rothko -- and saying entirely different things, about their approaches and their work. I also talked about Soho in the seventies. (The talk incidentally is collected at The Archives of American Art, http://www.aaa.si.edu/collections/collections_list.cfm/fuseaction/Collections.ViewCollection/CollectionID/6089)

Installation: Red River Valley series, 2004, Elizabeth Harris

BS: Two of your most recent bodies of work -- the Red River Valley series and Color Paintings -- were exhibited in New York in 2004 and 2006, respectively. In the Red River Valley group, you repeated one theme over nine canvases. In this series you subtly changed the colors from one picture to the next. With Color Paintings, you continued your goal of expanding the vocabulary of color in abstraction, with an additional focus on colors that have not been labeled or codified. Can you go into further detail about these paintings? What influenced you to create them?

PL: With the second group, paintings that have many no-name colors, I was looking for hues that don’t yet exist, that don’t immediately have a name when you try to describe them -- like the new words or combinations you sometimes get in poetry. I think many colors have become clichés. I made up my mind to avoid those and move onto more difficult and complex mixtures -- to give the viewers an experience they hadn’t had before. What I had in mind was a kind of abstracted landscape -- creating mysterious and elegant worlds through color. I tried to keep the surface as smooth and the format as unruffled as possible -- to drench the viewer in color.

I didn’t, and don’t, end a picture until it has what I consider a presence, a sense of life that extends beyond the painting. By sense of life I mean that it has an identity, like a place or person. Sometimes this takes a very long time to achieve. Sometimes it doesn’t happen -- and those are the pictures you don’t show.

BS: What about Red River Valley?

PL: Those came out of twelfth-- and thirteenth-- century stained glass windows I ‘d been looking at for several years in France. I came away with the idea that these anonymous stained glass artisans were the true and original fauve artists. I went to many French cathedrals -- Troyes, Laon, St. Chapelle, Chartres-- where the overwhelming sensation I had was simply the richness of red and blue. That, especially, is what I wanted to recreate in these canvases.

I also responded to the faintly homemade feel of early stained glass, and tried to recreate that impression as well. The structure in the pictures is always asymmetrical, with no line hitting at the same place in any of the divisions. In all my painting, I’m interested in what "difference" is and in how differences add up, creating assonance in the minor shifts between hues. As you continue to look at the paintings the differences "come up" and make you aware that what you saw at first is not what the paintings are about.

My reading of Proust and Eliot, my viewing of Bellini and Giorgione and Titian and Ablers and Cornell and Pollock, my listening to Bach and Thelonius Monk, my liking Eric Rohmer and Monty Python might seem totally unrelated, but they teach the same lesson: differences matter. When Monk plays a single note instead of another, a piece is either saved or ruined. When Albers puts a white next to a yellow instead of a blue, the yellow is changed -- and the white is changed too. If Proust chooses to follow one character instead of another, to write 50 pages about a dinner instead of four paragraphs, the reader's experience is alerted in the most intimate and immediate way. We look at works of art as single large units -- but they’re actually composed of hundreds, of thousands of individual and tiny units, each one a decision. It’s those units that I’ve been experimenting with throughout my career.

Installation: Red River Valley series, 2004, Elizabeth Harris

BS: Pat, you have stated the following: "Painting is about seeing. And that’s not easy. To see what you’ve done, to be able to actually see other work takes a lifetime. Seeing changes -- what I thought was very good last year might not look that good to me now. And when I put something away for six months and then take it out I’m a bit nervous at first. Will it hold up? Of course, it’s even worse when it’s your own work, because you are so subjectively wrapped up in it. It’s everyone and everything you know up until that moment." Would you say that you are your own worst critic? Do you think that is a good thing?

PL: Aside from Henry James -- who preferred the Academy to Monet -- I don’t believe there is a "worst critic." I do take my eye seriously, and I also like looking at my paintings with people I’m close to. Sometimes I’m surprised I couldn’t see that something wasn’t working from six months ago. It’s a humbling experience. It can go the other way too -- something I’ve ignored, pushed aside, actually is working. When you are standing next to another person looking together it objectifies the experience of seeing, and that's helpful. (James writes, in one of his stories, "he had a fresh eye, and I was in a good deal of need of any such organ" -- which is why nobody is ever really a worst critic.) As a painter it’s essential to be critical of your work, and to edit heavily. As Matisse said "An artist’s bad paintings are his own worst enemy."

BS: Pat, when I view your paintings I think about Mark Rothko. I must ask, has his work been an influence on your art? If so, have you ever visited the Rothko Chapel? If you have -- how did you feel upon entering? Also, who else has influenced your art?

PL: We’ve been talking today a lot about Rothko. I think his paintings of the fifties are brilliant -- along with Pollock some of the best pictures of the twentieth century. I don’t much like his later work, and although I’ve never been to the Rothko Chapel I’ve studied other pictures from after 1955 – some of the Seagram panels were shown at the National Gallery a few years ago, and there’s the late Rothko room at the Tate Gallery in England. To my eye, Rothko falls off in these paintings, which look almost as if they were done by someone imitating Rothko. I think it’s the turgid colors, the maroon palette, and the general darkening of hues -- none of it seems to suit his sensibility. To my mind these pictures are self-conscious, trying to look important and serious, and for that reason they miss both qualities. (I’ve actually heard that he’d invite people over to look at them and then play Mozart and ask if the paintings came up to that level.)

As for other influences, lately I’ve been influenced by Bellini and Titian, and northern Renaissance painters like Van Eyck and Rogier van der Weyden. When I was a teenager I loved Cezanne and Manet, who I became acquainted with through a set of posters from the Cortauld Gallery that hung in my bedroom. There are many others along the way, Pollock and Newman to name two Americans. And always I’ve admired Matisse, the great colorist.

Poussin Calm, oil on linen, 23 7/8” x 33 1/4”, 2007

BS: In your work you seem focused on the medium itself -- I sense that you are interested in the physicality of paint, how you can push it to make it do what you want. Is this so? Also, can you go into further detail about your painting process? How do you begin a painting?

PL: I do love paint. I love colors in tubes, and pure pigment -- I even love the names of colors. "Terre verte," "burnt sienna," "alizarin crimson." I am interested in surface, how to go about creating one that is rich, beautiful, elegant and smooth. And I’ve thought a lot about the expressive nature of surfaces -- for example in Chardin and Raphael and Soutine, the surface is the style. It’s the most personal thing.

For how I start a painting, I begin sometimes from a work on paper, but more often not. I usually have a pretty good idea of what I’m going to do, and usually that changes as I go along. Some paintings take years to complete. As Robert Frost once said of his poems, I try to "ride on my own melting."

BS: Pat, what are you working on at this time? Also, do you have any upcoming exhibitions?

PL: I’m working on some smaller paintings for the first time in many years, at the same time that I'm continuing the larger scale ones. And I’m recently back from Venice and Rome, so I’m playing with renaissance colors.

BS: As you know, many people have a hard time understanding (and sometimes even accepting) abstract art. In your opinion, why do you think that is? What would you say to someone who does not understand abstract art?

PL: I’d say, "Look again," and then I’d say, "Keep looking." Abstract art isn’t that difficult; it’s only a little tougher to get abstraction than representational painting, because it’s a new language. I think the highest moment we had in painting -- and maybe in any of the arts -- was Abstract Expressionism in the fifties. We were competing internationally for the first time. Seeing this work did involve some struggle on the part of the audience, some necessity to expand, to tolerate that feeling of being uncomfortable. But then we absorbed the style. The minute the deliberately vacuous Pop Art showed up, many of those same people breathed a sigh of relief and said, "Oh thank God. At least I can stop that struggle now. I can relax." Nabokov makes a great point somewhere; he says nothing dates quicker or more irrevocably than the avant-garde. Look at some of the most "modern" exhibits from the Venice Biennale last summer -- staged photographs of women abandoned by lovers, artists throwing licorice on the floor. How does that compare with the experience of taking in a Rothko, a Matisse, or a Pollock? The art that has replaced abstraction is about as visually rewarding as a trip to the super market -- and in lots of cases less so. Think of those great photographs of supermarkets by Gursky.

Portrait, oil on canvas, 24 3/8” x 38 5/8”, 2006

BS: Pat, tell us about your studio? What are the conditions you need to create? Do you work in silence or do you prefer to listen to music? What is it like to be in the studio of Pat Lipsky?

PL: I like silence -- which is very hard, if not impossible, to come by in New York City. I don’t listen to music when I’m working; it throws me off. I have a nice space with five windows and a skylight so the light is good. I know which wall gets the morning light and which the afternoon, and so I move around accordingly. And towards the end of the day, I notice I see better.

Installation: Color Paintings series, 2006, Elizabeth Harris

BS: Do you have any advice or suggestions for painters who are just starting out? Many young artists seem to fall into the trap of waiting to be discovered. As you know, that does not always happen. What is the best way for an emerging artist to put his or her best foot forward?

PL: I don’t know the answer to that question. I remember the late Clement Greenberg saying in lectures he gave in the Northeast, "Come to the center. The great artists of the past had to go to Rome, or Paris, and now it’s New York." On the other hand, there seems to be a way in which the art world climate is mirroring the political climate; both seem played out, full of evasions and numbness. So really I’m at a loss for advice, other than to say, "be true to yourself, trust your instincts." I guess what I’m saying is read Emerson’s "Self Reliance." It’s one of the most American texts, and also one of the best texts to give a young artist.

BS: Finally, is there anything else you would like to say about your art or the art world?

PL: No, I think that about covers it. Thank you.

Art Space Talk: Tom Bennett

Tom Bennett grew up in a household of artists-- he was influenced by his father, also an award-winning painter, Harry Bennett. Tom received a Bachelor of Fine Arts in Painting at the University of Connecticut where he studied under the painter and photographer, Bill Parker. Tom also studied design under Paul Zelansky. Since that time, Tom has been involved with numerous solo and group exhibits in the United States. He is represented internationally in both public and private collections that include the likes of Andy Warhol, Richard Diebenkorn, and David Hockney.


Brian Sherwin: Thomas, I understand that your father is also an artist. How did he influence you during your early years? Is he still an influence today?

Tom Bennett: I grew up in a house with art as a focus. I was drawing from the beginning, and my father once told me he knew I was going to be an artist when he looked at a drawing of a head I did at the age of 3. He noticed I had included the iris and pupil in the eyes of the face. He naturally was and is always an influence.

BS: Having viewed your work and the work of your father I must say that you have both went in your own direction as far as art is concerned. I assume that he did not push you toward a certain style. Care to share further information about your father and how he has supported your career as an artist?

TB: My father did not aggressively push me at all as a painter. My oldest sister was a prodigy and she may have resented any 'pushing" by him, so he decided to let me develop at my own pace. I made my first canvas oil painting at the age of 5 and was hooked.

BS: Thomas, aside from your father, who else has influenced your art? Have you been inspired by certain artists or art movements?

TB: As a kid, I was really into the artists from Mad magazine, like Mort Drucker. As a teenager, I became excited by painters like Degas, the pre-Rafaelites and Klimt. I discovered Francis Bacon in art school, who was and has been a major influence. deKooning, Diebenkorn, Frank Aurebach are some of the other figurative/expressionist-heroes of mine.

BS: Thomas, you attended the University of Connecticut where you earned a BFA- you decided not to pursue an MFA. Why did you make this choice? Also, how did you further your studies after college?

TB: I recall the last semester of art school and talking to a professor about my future. He suggested that I didn't need grad school. I should just paint and 'work in a factory" to support my painting. I had decided to take some time off from school anyway and moved to NY, painted, exhibited, and took odd jobs. I then went to Europe and never looked back.

BS: While in Barcelona you took part in group shows and had two one-man shows. Can you recall how the scene was at that time? Also, why did you decide to leave Barcelona?

TB: I arrived in Barcelona and developed friendships with mostly ex-patriots. I met some local painters such as Santi Moix, who has quite an international reputation today. Ultimately, through some of my acquaintances I found an apt with a painting studio in the marina section of the city, a few yards from the sea. It was a wonderful place to paint. I got legal working status in Barcelona, but couldn't make any money, outside of the occasional gig teaching English. I sold some paintings now and then, but I returned to the States, thinking I had too many financial obligations and I had difficulty making any sort of income in Barcelona.

BS: Thomas, when you moved back to New York you moved into the Williamsburg section of Brooklyn just before the influx of artists who moved into that area. Can you recall any experiences or events you observed during that time? I assume that you settled before prices skyrocketed?

TB: I knew nothing of Brooklyn when I returned to NY. I saw it as some alien planet. My friend Rick had invited me to share an apt in Greenpoint/Williamsburg, I needed a place to live, so I went. Later I found my own studio across the street from a crackhouse on South 2nd Street. I would be walking home and cops would ask me what I was doing, suspecting me of buying drugs. I would say, " I live here.' They would stare blankly at me. They were shocked. I was one of a handful of artists in that neighborhood at the time. It was all great old polish kielbasa shops and businesses that had been there for generations. It was around that time the first galleries started opening. Today, it's vastly changed. Sky-rise apartment buildings are going up and there are 2-bedroom apartments going for a million dollars or more.

BS: Thomas, you have said the following about your art, "Though I'm strongly influenced by my classical training, I love pushing the medium around. Motion is essential. I'm always thinking about how muscles and forms can almost connect.", can you go into further detail about your art and what you are striving to do?

TB: Painting is foremost a physical act for me. I love the materials. Movement is a natural outcome of the way I approach the work, whether it's a drawing, monotype or painting. The process, of course is the exhilarating thing, and when the product incites a strong emotional or psychic response, I've succeeded. A good piece of art is one that can hold many layered ambiguous narratives or allegories.The viewer brings his own interpretations to the work and the hope is that there is an ongoing dialogue between the two. Over the last several months I've been making homage paintings referencing some classical works I've chosen for both their formal strength and /or the allegory involved. I like the interpretation and re-translation of these images in our art-historical collective unconscious.

BS: Thomas, can you discuss the darkness of some of your works? They often reveal a haunting atmosphere. Do these images capture your thoughts about current events? Are you conveying a certain mood with these images? Or do you just prefer to work in that manner?

TB: It's really always been a natural. unconscious thing for me. I'm really a nice guy outside the studio.

BS: Thomas, I've read that you are represented internationally in both public and private collections that include the likes of Andy Warhol, Richard Diebenkorn, and David Hockney. Where can our readers go to view your art?

TB: I'm represented by Tabla Rasa gallery in Brooklyn, NY and the Riversea gallery in Astoria, OR.

BS: Thomas, you exhibited with World Artist Network during the WAN Gallery Inaugural Show in Baltimore, MD. As you know, WAN had long been one of the largest art groups on myspace.com. At one time, their membership was over 100,000. How did you get involved with WAN? Can you tell us more about WAN and why you agree with their philosophy?

TB: WAN is an open forum for the exchange of ideas and the opportunity to form alliances with like-minded artists. It's members include really exciting people with fresh ideas and powerful work.

BS: Thomas, tell us about your studio. Do you work in silence? Or do you prefer to listen to music while working on your art? What are the conditions you need to focus on your art?

TB: My studio takes up the entire top floor of my house in Brooklyn. Because it's located in my home, it's easy to be distracted. Therefore I must shut the door and shut out the world. I do work with music or NPR on the radio. I'll listen to everything from old blues music to Beethoven, depending on where I am in my head that day.

BS: Thomas, can you tell us more about your artistic process? How do you start a piece? Do you plan it out in your head first... draw it out? What are the first steps you make when creating?

TB: Sometimes I'll do drawings and monotypes working out ideas and I'll build on that. Sometimes I'll take a leap from photographic reference I've found or shot myself. I also work from life. It depends on the project. Once I actualize the process., it's a continuous dance between lawlessness and order. By that I mean it's allowing the intuitive subconscious to work with conscious control.

BS: Thomas, do you have any upcoming exhibits?

TB: I'm working out developing a show here in Brooklyn for early next year, but the dates aren't set. I'll be in a group show at the Visual Art Center of Northern NJ in January. My work can be seen at the Riversea Gallery in Astoria, OR, and the Tabla Rasa Gallery in Brooklyn , NY.

You can learn more about Tom Bennett and his art by visiting his website: www.tombennettart.com

Take care, Stay true,

Brian Sherwin

Art Space Talk: Michael Cutlip

Michael Cutlip creates abstract landscapes of lines, markings, brush strokes, spray paint blots, and graphite smudges. The artist works intuitively, as he feels a planned painting is a failed painting. Process is essential to Cutlip's works on panel - during which time his painting is free to wander.

Horse Power, Mixed on Panel, 24" x 24"

Brian Sherwin: Michael, you are represented by Melanee Cooper Gallery in Chicago. Do you have any upcoming exhibits with the gallery? Also, where else can our readers observe your art in person?

Michael Cutlip: I'm going to be part of an exhibit called "Cool Globes" in Chicago. It's an innovative project that uses the medium of public art to inspire individuals and organizations to take action against global warming. www.coolglobes.com. I will also be part of a three-person show in New York next month at Stricoff Fine Art.

Up until the past 1-2 years I have mainly exhibited here in California. I now have representation in Chicago, New York, Denver, and a few other cities across the country.

Obsession, Mixed on Panel, 48" x 48"

BS: Michael, let us take a step back-- can you recall any experiences from your youth that helped guide you on the path you are on today? Tell us about your early experiences in art.

MC: I wasn't really into art as a child...other than an occasional brush with a box of Crayola's. I played the saxophone in the school band growing up...so music was always my creative elective. I was 23 and in college when I took my first drawing class. It changed my life forever.

BS: Michael, where did you study art? Who were your mentors?

MC: As I mentioned above...I kind of discovered my passion for art accidentally. I was studying business (God knows why!) at Cal State University Hayward (definitely not a none school for the arts). I was ONE semester away from getting my degree and I realized I needed to fulfill an elective requirement. I thought Drawing would be easy and decided to go for it. What happened next came completely by surprise. I became completely seduced by this new world I had discovered. The man who taught that class was and still is my sole mentor. He was an older man (maybe in his early 70's at that time), but he had the spirit of a twenty-year old. He was amazing, and inspired the hell out of me. He saw beyond my clumsy, awkward drawings and told me he saw art. Well, I was hooked from that point on. I never finished up the business degree and continued to study art for the next 4 years. I then finally received my degree in fine art after 8 years of college.

Pollinate, Mixed on Wood Panel, 48" x 48"

BS: Michael, you have been involved with several impressive group exhibits- including Bridge Art Fair Miami in 2006. Do you enjoy art fairs? I've spoken with several artists about art fairs and have had mixed opinions. Some artists feel that they threaten the stability of the traditional art market. Do you see the fairs as a threat or do you feel that they are important for the vitality of art as a whole?

MC: I can't say that I really have a strong opinion about that. They seem to be the wave of the future for better or for worse.

BS: Michael, you work with mixed medium on panel. Why do you prefer that surface over say... canvas? Also, can you go into further detail about your artistic process... how do you start a piece? Do you 'map' it out in your head? Or do you go where your imagination takes you, so to speak?

MC: I personally hate working on canvas... I tend to fight the texture. I prefer the smooth surface of the wood. Wood is also more durable..I always tear canvas when I work on it. I use electric sanders and scratch into it, so canvas doesn't work.

As far as my process...no, I definitely do not map out a painting. Ideas are dangerous in my mind. When ever I come up with a "great idea". I am sure to fail. I am very process oriented, so the paintings evolve naturally from one move to the next. I definitely have a process (as most artist's do), but I don't really think about it much when I am working. I go on auto-pilot, so to speak.

Discoveries, Mixed on Wood Panel, 36" x 36"

BS: Michael, have you been influenced by other artists or art movements? Where else do you draw inspiration from?

MC: I honestly do not frequent the art galleries too often. So, art, in it's traditional form, doesn't have much influence over me. Well, on some level, I'm sure it does...I just don't think about it too much. I'm inspired a lot by everyday things i see on the street. I like graffiti, street art, a lot. Mostly, I inspire myself, through the process of creating. When I make a mark and my heart starts to beat a little bit faster...that's the good stuff!

Time Line, Mixed on Wood Panel, 48" x 48"

BS: Michael, what projects are you working on at this time? Have you been working on a new body of art?

MC: I don't really see my work as separate bodies of work. Each piece evolves from the last and so on and so on. I did just finish a mural in Tokyo Japan. That mixed things up for me a bit...I was quite pleased with the result.

BS: Michael, have you ever collaborated on a project? If not, do you plan to at some point in the future?

MC: My wife is a painter also...we use to do a lot of collaborative stuff back when we were in school together. For some reason that stopped. I don't really think it was because we were a couple...it's just very difficult for me to work that way. Although, I did have a positive experience a few months back. I invited a painter friend of mine to help me out with a failing painting...we ended up working all night on it together. It opened up some doors for me, that I may not have found on my own. The painting itself is so, so...but, some good discoveries were made.

My best collaborative experience was when I was in school. A painting professor and I spent the better part of one summer painting a mural in the university library. The thing was two stories tall, so we had to work on scaffolding. I felt like F***ing Diego Rivera up there...It was awesome!! If you are ever in the CSUH library, it is still there. It is a big abstract piece, unusual for a mural.

Black Bird, Mixed on Wood Panel, 24" x 24"

BS: Michael, tell us about your studio. What are the conditions you need in order to work. Do you prefer silence? Or do you enjoy listening to music while you create? Do you follow a routine or do you work sporadically?

MC: Music...of course. I do tend to follow a routine. Although, that is my life in general these days. I have two small children...family life has definitely made me more of a 9 - 5'er.

BS: Michael, do you have any suggestions for artists who are just starting out?

MC: I would just say...focus on what's most important, that being you work. The rest will figure itself out.

BS: Finally, is there anything else you would like to say about your art or the artworld?

MC: My old painting professor use to say to me, before exiting the room..."Keep your Brushes wet"...I like that. Just keep working!

You can learn more about Michael Cutlip and his art by visiting his website: www.michaelcutlip.com. You can view my other interviews by visiting the following link: www.myartspace.com/interviews/

Take care, Stay true,

Brian Sherwin

Art Space Talk: Jerome Prieur

Jerome Prieur examines the profane elements of day-to-day life-- the intricacies, eccentricities, and absurdities that define humanity and modern life. A central focus on his subjects’ bodies allows him to explore careers, hobbies, relationships and social roles that are re-invented and reinterpreted through the complexity of his work and his unique stylistic approach. This results in studies that appear to be a mix of science and psychology-- mangled together within the context of contemporary society.

Brian Sherwin: Jerome, I've read that you were raised in a family of artists. Can you recall any early experiences you had with art? Who first noticed your talent?

Jerome Prieur: I remember that it all started with dinosaurs. I was completely fascinated and began to draw them. A vivid memory would have been when I was 7 years old, I did a drawing of a T-Rex and I came into class and asked permission to show and talk about it. This would have been my first public showing of something that I was proud and passionate about. During my youth and teenage years my teachers and classmates knew that the only things that mattered to me were to do with the arts, as I had the worse marks (except in Art)!

My parents and my sister were the first to notice, and still help in my research through conversation and location of resources (my mom is forever bringing me books on subjects I am interested in). I could never thank them enough for all the liberty they gave me and understanding about my artistic thoughts and pursuits. Let’s say that I rarely paint anything "really pretty", but they know me well enough to know the inner meanings of my pieces and for them it is natural.

BS: Jerome, you have collaborated with artist Marie-Josee Roy and Grant Cunningham. Can you go into detail about this experience? I assume that you enjoy collaborating with friends, but are their draw-backs to these forms of artistic unions? Creative differences? Or do you think that is more of a question of who you are working with and for how long? Do you plan to work with anyone in the near future?

JP: Marie-Josee Roy is my prime example of my trust and confidence in showing with other artists. Marie-Josee and I have known each other for 20 years and have had numerous shows together; even today we are respectfully represented by the same galleries on the same street! For mysterious reasons we unintentionally follow each other and ironically a lot of clients buy our works without even knowing about our relationship (keep in mind these would be separate from our group shows). We grew together surrounded by art and sharing ideas. Even though our styles are completely different we complement each other.

Grant Cunningham is another example. We have shown together. We are more into the individual rather than our artistic approaches, yet we dig each others works. Marie-Josee, Grant and myself collaborated in 2003 on a piece entitled "3 dissection de l’interieur" This piece united 3 self-portraits on one canvas. Were there any draw-backs? No, we painted our sections, swapping the canvas between us, and then we showed it, had a vernissage, and got drunk. Off it went to a new owner!

I am very fond of being around other artists. Some say that it can be awkward at times; I have not experienced that aspect. Perhaps that is because I truly believe that art is a freedom of speech and is not competitive as a corporation would be. Artistic ideas are too individual and personal to be copied. I love to see my fellow artists grow in their works and addition to their CVs etc. In our society, the best gift is for me to see any artists make it out there.

BS: Jerome, what else can you tell us about the underground art scene in Canada?

JP: The underground scene is Canada in my opinion is growing. In the USA the underground art scene has grown very rapidly and it is currently catching up in Canada. Mind you, "underground, lowbrow, contemporary"…whatever we currently are labeling it, is in my opinion a vague series of words; you have serious artists that respect the genre and you have others that claim to be part of it, yet without completely understanding it. Furthermore, we have artists that are doing great works, but yet fall between these categories, depending on how narrowly we define it.

So far, I have been really fortunate to have met and shown with very creative minds, most of us have began in the underground art world, this underground scene in Canada is very broad, often it touches further than just art, it is fashion, stage shows, performing arts, music, poetry, spoken word, literature, film etc. I find in Canada that we put a great deal of effort into everything that revolves around the arts, and from there we network together; and it ends up being at everyone’s advantage. Especially the underground, as it is often associated with the unique, the unusual, freedom of speech and the non-commercial production of art.

BS: Jerome, tell us about your art.... you are obviously influenced by Art Nouveau- can you tell us more about artists and art movements that have influenced your work?

JP: Gaudi is my hero! I have been an admirer of his work since I was a teenager. Hector Guimard is also a very strong influence in my works. Art-Nouveau, to me, is a design and architectural movement that will never be equalized in our modern world (the cost of such creation and the freedom of imagination through patronage…you cannot find this, not in today’s economy and trends). The mystical aspect of such style is that it is the only architectural movement that flows yet is motionless.

If you look at one of my paintings, it is truly inspired by the movement, but I make it my own without stealing specifics, from the subject’s clothing to the fusion between human flesh, mechanics and objects. Art-Nouveau is soft, I have been told many times that the subjects I use for my paintings are perceived as harsh, but the implementation of an art-nouveau style softens it enough for people to attend and to have time to really contemplate what the piece is about. If the subject matter is challenging, then they can get lost in the intricacies of the technical skill and details of the lines.

BS: Jerome, where else do you find inspiration? Your work contains a lot of visual information pulled from several sources... your images are like an explosion of genres scattered upon the surface in a controlled manner. I see references to cyber-punk themes, old side-show posters, every traditional playing cards. I get the feeling that you could write an essay about your interests and how they are conveyed in your art. Can you explain how you get all of these ideas to come together... to mesh as they do?

JP: Upon a multitude of situations, I question the human body and it’s relevance to our incomprehensible society, our limits, our abnormalities and our mortality. These subjects are transformed by the fusion of science, genetics, mechanics, madness and humour. I am always revisiting subjects and objects to make them more efficient.

For example, I am currently finishing a painting involving a boxer whose legs have been amputated and fused with giant mechanical grasshoppers (to help him skip in the ring). Additionally, two tiny elephant heads are fused to his shoulders, and using the water from his body splash water on his face. This is an ‘improved’ version of the recognizable white water bottles used in the ring. These are two examples specific to the subject, out of many in the overall piece, which show my ‘making’ (reconstruction) of the boxer. I am inspired by the overall body, as well as the individual aspects of it, and how this is so perfectly engineered.

I paint a lot about what we do as humans. I take a lot of inspiration by people’s professions. When you think about it, even in our free time, our careers are what define us in so many ways, we talk about it, we are even questioned on a first date, and we are often remembered by our career when we die.

The word "controlled" in your question is the one I have always struggled to explain. I am not sure where it comes from and why I spend so many hours on details. To help me understand my strange behavior toward tiny details is that I say to myself that the best car prototypes always take years to achieve, so it makes me feel better! The only answer I can find is that the subjects I create have to be perfectly engineered and rendered. Therefore this perfection, this controlled environment of my paintings, needs to be controlled by its creator. Think of a mad scientist. I guess I would be a mad ‘scientartist’. Everything must have its place. Every piece of the larger work must be eloquently drawn to fuse properly into the next. By doing this I create a flow that connects all random, obscene, and conflicting details.

I do write essays about my work when I get a chance, I feel that it is important, sometimes the essays are not made public, I know that whenever a piece sells, I often get a request from the new owner to write about the piece, I do it gladly. Writing about a piece in length after its creation is a great time to decompress.

BS: Jerome, tell us about your studio. Where do you work? What conditions must you have in order to create?

JP: I live and work in my studio in Montreal, Quebec, Canada. My conditions in terms of working is a lot of music, books and a TV playing with lots of films , that I watch over and over again. I have an old dining room table that I paint on. I work on a flat surface, no easel. I paint my largest canvases by propping them against the wall and painting them standing up.

BS: Jerome, what projects are you working on at this time as far as your personal art is concerned?

JP: I am currently working on a piece that will be shown at Yves Laroche galerie in Montreal for a group show called Sweet Calvares in October. It is about my hate for the KKKs. This exhibit is around the theme of celebrating death and I have decided to paint my own pay-back to the @**%^^&# KKK and the damages they have done. It is simultaneously political and factual. I love painting it. I knew I would do this piece or one similar to it eventually, and it should be done in about a month… or so. Then, I have a few group exhibits here and there in Canada and the USA. When the Laroche show is over, I will be starting a new series of paintings, with the goal of a solo show. Not sure where it will be yet, but I have not had one since 2005 and I already miss it!

BS: Finally, is there anything else you would like to say about your art or the artworld?

JP: The art world is very indefinable and very vague. What is art? What is good talent? Who is posing? All of which are cyclical and unanswerable questions. Our economy forces us to either self-promote or to rely on a gallerist in order to survive. What I can say is that there are so many amazing talents that deserve a strong base in our economies and a just legacy. The public needs to be educated regarding emerging and living artists. How to seek them out, how to access art, etc. Our masters often starved and were misunderstood when they put their art/creations forward. The support was not always there.

In today’s economy, political climate, etc., we are dealing with an entirely different, yet strikingly similar situation. Who patronizes the arts? We cannot deify the art world/market. It is not an entity that is dictating to us, it is something that we control. Either we feed it and it grows and (re)produces, or we starve it and it dies. It is easy once someone dies to recognize their talent as their body of work and their capacity to create becomes finite (at this point we know they will not fail us).

You can learn more about Jerome Prieur by visiting his website: www.jeromeprieur.com. Feel free to read my other interviews by visiting the following page: www.myartspace.com/interviews

Take care, Stay true

Brian Sherwin

Art Space News: 'Bling' Skull goes for Big Bucks

(The work, entitled "For the Love of God," is a skull cast in platinum and encrusted with 8,601 diamonds.)

Damien Hirst's latest piece-- "For the Love of God"-- sold last Thursday for 100 million dollars (75 million euros), a record price for work sold by a living artist. A spokeswoman for the White Cube gallery in London, where the piece had been on display, stated that the diamond-encrusted skull was sold to a group of anonymous investors. The skull has been hammered in the press and by onlookers for being nothing more than a form of 'bling'-- an overly expensive item that is nothing more than an indication of wealth.

Hirst remains best known for earlier conceptual works in which creatures including a shark and a cow were preserved in formaldehyde within glass tanks. Critics have stated that the British artist would not have a career had a "corpse not been involved"-- a statement referring to Hirst's earlier work, statements he has made to the press, and his most recent venture. Nevertheless, Hirst has earned a large following of supporters throughout his career regardless of the controversy that surrounds him.

The controversy over Hirst's art is not the only media bombardment that the artist has had to deal with. He once made the grave error of stating that the September 11, 2001 attacks in the United States were like a work of art. On September 10, 2002, on the eve of the first anniversary of the 9/11 World Trade Center attacks, Hirst said in an interview with BBC News Online:

"The thing about 9/11 is that it's kind of like an artwork in its own right ... Of course, it's visually stunning and you've got to hand it to them on some level because they've achieved something which nobody would have ever have thought possible - especially to a country as big as America. So on one level they kind of need congratulating, which a lot of people shy away from, which is a very dangerous thing."

Due to public outrage, Hirst issued the following statement:

"I apologise unreservedly for any upset I have caused, particularly to the families of the victims of the events on that terrible day."

'Bling' or not-- the skull sold. What do you think? Does Hirst profit off of death and suffering? Does it matter if he does? Do you think there was a sense of passion behind the creation of "For the Love of God"? Or do you assume that the piece was nothing more than an example of a man showing off his wealth? Discuss.

Art Space Talk: Mie Olise Kjaergaard

Mie Olise Kjaergaard is one of four artists who will be featured in Saatchi's 4 New Sensations exhibit-- a Channel 4 Prize for STUART 2007 graduates. The four were chosen from a selection of twenty finalists.

Mie's art is inspired by abandoned places and desolate spaces. She captures the essence of these spaces primarily through painting, but she also constructs models of wood and cardboard. Mie is trained as an architect and is interested in constructions, perspectives, and scales of places that have been left behind by human beings.

In her work she asks, "What happened here? Did I leave it myself? Who left it? Why?" Mie attempts to find pieces of the answers by utilizing architectural constructions, perspectives and putting together different scales in order to tell stories that psychologically investigate the desolation and memories left by the presence of these forgotten spaces-- the ghosts of industrialization.

(A section of Mie's studio.)

Brian Sherwin: Mie, you have studied at the Byam Shaw School of Art and at London University of the Arts. Who were your mentors?

Mie Olise Kjaergaard: My mentors are: the writer Chris-Kul Want, artists Clive Hogson, Douglas Alsop, plus my fellow students. I am finishing next month.

BS: Mie, can you recall any early events that directed you toward being an artist?

MOK: As a child I built shoebox-cities and made Christmas calendars for my school mates. I saw every problem as an opportunity. I fixed things, especially bikes. I painted my first big canvas when I was 15. At that time I started looking at art, and sat in the art section, of the libary looking through the same 5 books again, and again.

BS: Mie, you have been chosen to be one of four finalists in Saatchi's 4 New Sensations competition. You will be exhibiting alongside- Marcus Lanyon, Mark Melvin, and Sarah Maple. How did you feel when you were informed that you had been chosen? Also, how does it feel to know that your work will be on view during the Frieze fair? Are you nervous?

MOK: I am excited. And of course happy that they chose me. I am looking forward to show my work. I am working on the project right now, and it´s a new approach as it´s more fantasy, subject wise; "What will happen in 25 years"! That´s fun.

BS: Mie, you work with abandoned places and desolate spaces... you use them as references for your paintings, but you also build models of these structures out of wood and cardboard. Why are you so interested in these structures? Do they have a spiritual meaning for you? Or do you see them as a sign of 'our times', so to speak?

MOK: I just like structures like that. Huge man-made things falling apart. It obviously tells a story at many levels. It´s a machine, something built for a purpose, and yet the purpose didn´t last, and the structure stands there, as a visual witness of an idea that fell to the ground. I can be terribly romantic and brutal.

There are references to the actual places, but as my working process starts, it becomes something else. A metaphor, a visual interpretation, and the labyrinth of painting is entered. That means a lot of questions, problems, and discussion, not so much about the abandoned place, but about the painting. Which colours I want to use, which ones I can´t use, I set up small rules for myself, as a way of choosing a different approach, and developing my practice.

The same things happen with the structures. The structures are never built on somewhere I have seen. I relate to the space I am building it in. And from there, I try to create a flow through the space, and especially concentrate on the body's experience around the construction, on a psychological level.

I am on my way to Istanbul tonight, to build a structure with sound and moving images in it. I got a girl, Sona, to find me an abandoned place and describe it in words... she says it has pyramids on the roof. In that way the structure becomes a place of mind-- somewhere in between Sona´s actual discoveries and my interpretations of her descriptions. When I have built my model, I will be visiting the site, and probably get very surprised.

BS: Mie, upon entering an abandoned building.... for example, an old warehouse- how do you feel? What thoughts cross your mind?

MOK: I think I'm very sensitive towards space, and construction. It fascinates me to get near desolate huge structures. It´s like, it has taken over, as man left. It´s funny, living in big cities, where people might be carrying knives and shot guns-- that I can be scared of nature! In a way these structures are becoming nature again. But I am also very interested in the architecture of these machines. It is very fantastic, yet every little detail has a specific function for the structure. I guess I analyze the buildings, and then I build on top of them or break them down.

BS: Mie, I've read that you have an idea for a future project. You call it 'Future of Place'. You have stated that your goal is to find a building that has been built this year and observe the building for 25 years- in order to capture how it expands or falls into obscurity. Tell me more about this project. What exactly are your goals?Have you found a building yet?

MOK: That is the project that I am working on for the 4NS, during Frieze. I have found the site (it´s in Bloomsbury, London) and have built a little model of it. Right now I am asking a lot: what if ... and what if...? It´s gonna become five paintings.

Apart from that, I don´t really have goals. I guess that's the thing about painting. That you simply don´t know it before you have gone through the labyrinth. It appears while you walk, and along the path you have to solve a lot of problems--ask a lot of questions.

For this project my ideas are more radical, I am working with contrasts; rather than obvious perspectives like decay or refurbishments.

BS: Mie, what other plans or project ideas do you have at this time? Also, do you plan to collaborate with anyone in the near future? Or do you work alone?

MOK: The Istanbul Project is a collaboration called The Triangle Project. It is a collaboration between New York, Istanbul and Copenhagen artist. It runs for 3 years, and will be happening in New York starting in the spring of 2008. Danish composer Goodipal has made the sound for my project. I just met him this morning and played around with a lot of items that will be put in top of the loudspeakers-- to distort the sound.

I also have an artist group in Cph, +LABORATORIUM/FMstereo, we were running a shop and exhibition space for five years, and still do "city investigation projects" together. I am curating a show in London with a friend in the spring. So I like to collaborate on different levels, according to the projects.

BS: Mie, I understand that you draw inspiration from several sources-- including psychology. Can you go into further detail about how the study of psychology has influenced your art? Do you enjoy the work of Jung? Would you say that your art is a psychological study... a way of 'charting' yourself or society, so to speak?

MOK: Especially in my installations (constructions with video in it), it becomes very essential of how people move around them. If they crawl, peep through a hole, go close to something, feel something rough and huge, soft or close. It all makes you react on a psychological level. And that´s a sort of communication. I am interested in Freud and Jung, and in perception theories in general. I make studies in models, and investigate. I set up my own laboratory experiments, rather than read books. I see my works as an exploration of my ideas, it´s clearly pseudo scientific; and subjective! Objective Art is Science!

BS: Mie, I understand that you have been looking into the work of photographer William Christenburry, whose images from Alabama have a touch of decay. You have stated that the 'abandoned and uncanniness' that he conveys with his work is close to what you want to express in your work- you went on to say that some of his work "scares the hell out of" you. By implication does this statement suggest that you want to 'scare the hell' out of people who view your work? Do you want to challenge peoples sensitivities... their fears?

MOK: I think it´s that fear, that makes me interested in the work of William Christenburry. I find it very inspiring! The silence, the desolation. Coming back to the same place through many years, and recording the changes. And the fact that nothingness (the empty), can be scary.

This summer I went to an abandoned Russian city, The pyramid, on Norwegian ground near the North-pole. It´s a communist utopia that was left within 3 months. There are books still in the libary, furniture still in the houses, and glasses still in the hotel bar-- ready for mixing another drink. I worked in video, as the crazy thing about that place is that it actually exists!

But because painting is-- and has to be --very different from photography and video, it´s also quickly becomes-- painting! It is built up of nothing, but paint, brush-strokes, colours, layers, texture-- within a canvas. It becomes a system of problems, a way to go through a process. So many things occur, and I like that journey.

I would like people to stand in front of my paintings or structures, switch off half their brains, and just look and explore. If it hits them, it´s good! I can´t specify what people should feel, the work has to communicate itself. I tend to get mostly hit in my stomach. If I could do that to people-- then I would be very happy!

BS: Are you represented by a gallery at this time? If not, are you seeking gallery representation?

MOK: I have a Danish gallery, that represents me there. Working in London, I think it would be interesting to show my work here-- in a gallery, non-commercial space, or even an apartment. I see my work as communication, and therefore I like to show it.

BS: Finally, is there anything else you would like to say about your art or the artworld?

MOK: Art is a visual language, so maybe it´s time for me to stop talking...

You can learn more about Mie Olise Kjaergaard by visiting the following sites:

www.olise.dk, www.myspace.com/mieolise, www.saatchi-gallery.co.uk/4newsensations/

Also, you can view more interviews by clicking on the following link: www.myartspace.com/interviews/

Take care, Stay true,

Brian Sherwin